Huhne, Harris and Willis quiz Johnson on Drugs Policy

• [Nov 02] Christopher Huhne (Eastleigh, Liberal Democrat): ' . . WILL he apologise to Professor Nutt and set up the advisory council on a clearly independent basis to ensure that he does not recruit an army of nodding yes-men? Will Ministers now agree to a code of practice to stop themselves being ludicrously thin-skinned if they foolishly choose policy options that are not supported by the scientific evidence? . . '

Both the Home Secretary and Chris Grayling have missed the point. The hon. Gentleman is at risk, indeed, of becoming the Home Secretary's Mini-Me, because today he again insisted that the only difference between them was that he thought Professor Nutt should have been sacked sooner. The Government do not want evidence, and the official Opposition want even less evidence even more quickly.

The Government rely on objective, impartial and unpaid advice from leading experts on everything from nuclear safety to mad cow disease, and the comments to which the right hon. Gentleman and hon. Gentleman object were in no way contrary to the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs code of practice or the general code of practice for advisory committees. The Home Secretary signally failed to give us chapter and verse on that or to mention it in the letter that he sent to Professor Nutt.

Professor Nutt's specialism is the relative harm of drugs, and his so-called campaigning vehicles were the peer-reviewed Journal of Psychopharmacology and a lecture at King's college London. If scientists advising the Government are not allowed to write in learned journals and lecture at universities, does the Home Secretary agree that very few will be prepared to accept such absurd restrictions?

Why did the Home Secretary fail to consult the Minister for Science and Innovation, Lord Drayson, before blundering into this area and imperilling independent scientific advice across the Government? Will he apologise to Professor Nutt and set up the advisory council on a clearly independent basis to ensure that he does not recruit an army of nodding yes-men? Will Ministers now agree to a code of practice to stop themselves being ludicrously thin-skinned if they foolishly choose policy options that are not supported by the scientific evidence?

Alan Johnson (Home Secretary; Kingston upon Hull West & Hessle, Labour): Piety and pomposity in equal measure. The Government, and I in particular, have listened to scientific advice. We took through the Human Fertilisation and Embryology Act 2008, and there was an awful lot of science in that. We respect the views of scientists, and we have respected the views of scientists in every aspect of Government policy. Our principal advisers-whether Sir David King, John Beddington, Sir Liam Donaldson or Professor Nutt-have to be clear that when they are appointed to such a crucial and privileged job- [Interruption.]

John Bercow (Speaker): Order. I apologise for interrupting the Home Secretary. I must say to Chris Huhne that he is unduly overexcited this afternoon-uncharacteristically so. He has had his say- [Interruption.] Order. I do not need any help from hon. Members on the Government Back Benches. The hon. Gentleman has had his say with force, and he now needs to listen to the response from the Home Secretary.

Alan Johnson: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

When such esteemed professionals take on such a job, they have the Government's ear. They have a very important role in influencing the Government, and they must exercise it with care and caution. It would be quite wrong for advisers to undermine the Government as well as advise them.

There is absolutely no question about Professor Nutt's right to express his views. He has a view on relative harms, which I do not share; he has a view on ecstasy, which I do not share; and he has a view on cannabis, which I and the majority of the House do not share. We are not talking about his right to express those views-he can do that. What he cannot do is confuse his role as a Government adviser and confuse it in the public mind by continually criticising the Government's framework, agreed by this Parliament, on tackling drugs. That is quite wrong. Sir David King did not do that when he recommended nuclear new build and the Government at that time did not agree to it. Sir Liam Donaldson has not done it on numerous occasions, including most recently when he proposed the introduction of unit pricing for alcohol; his proposal was produced, and it was public knowledge and transparent, but he did not go out and campaign against the Government for having refused to accept his policy.

My final point is about what Professor Nutt did last week at King's college; incidentally, he was opposed by Professor Robin Murray, the head of psychiatric research, who takes a completely different view. What Professor Nutt did there was to criticise my predecessor, criticise the Prime Minister, criticise the Government and undermine the whole framework of Government policy. That was wrong, and as a result I have lost confidence in his ability to advise me.

• . . Evan Harris (Oxford West & Abingdon, Liberal Democrat): If a scientist is appointed a Government adviser but then told that what he says is dependent on the Government's policy, how can he be an independent scientist when advising the Government?

Alan Johnson: I did not say that, but I can say what Government advisers should not do. Once a decision has been made on their recommendations, that is it; they should get on with being the Government's adviser, not continually return to that decision and seek to undermine the Government's framework. That is quite wrong, and Sir David King, who was an eminent chief scientific adviser to the Government, said as much on Friday evening in reference to this case. A calmer, more rational view, which may be impossible from Dr. Harris, will suggest that we are in no way attacking science or scientists. We are dealing with one particular case.

• . . Phil Willis (Harrogate & Knaresborough, Liberal Democrat): The Government's chief scientific adviser is Professor John Beddington, who in February criticised the former Home Secretary for the way in which she treated Professor Nutt. Did the Home Secretary discuss the sacking of Professor Nutt with John Beddington before carrying out that act this weekend?

Alan Johnson: I did not discuss it with anybody. It was my decision; he was my adviser and I decided that he had lost my confidence by his actions. It is my confidence that he has to keep, and nobody else's, so I took the action that I am perfectly entitled to take as Home Secretary. I have huge respect for John Beddington, who I believe is abroad at the moment on his work, and I will obviously talk to him on this and other occasions.

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